We’ve all heard or read about the strict laws and forms of punishment in Saudi Arabia. The most notorious of which is cutting off the hands of thieves. But many people don’t dig deep enough to know that a thief has to steal a substantial amount to get that punishment. No one gets their hand cut for petty theft, but when you have a gang who goes around robbing houses, then that punishment comes onto the table. In all my years here, I’ve only heard about it happening once. A friend of mine had their apartment robbed. Jewelry, TVs, computers and everything of value was taken. Eventually the robber was caught and my friend’s father was asked if he would forgive the robber or not. His refusal to forgive him contributed to the judge’s decision to have the thief’s hand cut off. I don’t know the details such as whether or not the thief had a previous history of stealing. I do know that this type of punishment does not happen often. Another instance is one time my husband and I met a real estate agent to show us a house we were interested in. This guy was a young apparently healthy Saudi guy and one of his hands was cut right at the wrist. Both my husband and I did not say anything so I don’t know if it was cut off as punishment or due to an accident or illness but I bet lots of people wonder when they meet him.
The punishments that are most newsworthy when it comes to Saudi Arabia, are the ones given to people guilty of khilwa (unrelated man and woman alone together) and extramarital sex. A punishment for khilwa is common and we’ve all come across muttawas trolling coffee shops and restaurants searching for pairs who seem too happy to be related. But what happens after they are caught? I don’t know about expatriates but with Saudis, the man and woman are separated at the spot and questioned to see if their stories correspond. Questions like name, relatives’ names and even color of furniture, address, employment and all other things married couples naturally know. If they fail the test or refuse to cooperate, they are taken to the local muttawa center. The girl’s father is summoned and the guy is locked up usually after being given a few slaps and punches. The girl is handed over to her father (if he’ll take her) and the guy is later released after they put his information into the system. He is then required to show up in front of a judge, usually two weeks later to take his sentence. How he appears at the sentencing decides his fate more than anything else. The way he dresses and addresses the judge has more influence than the number of times he has been caught, how and where he was caught…etc. His best bet is to dress like a muttawa, start to grow a beard, hold his head down and look remorseful. He should also tell the judge that since the incident, he has become a born again Muslim. If he could get an established muttawa from a mosque to vouch for him, then he might be lucky enough to be let go with a warning. Otherwise he will most likely be sentenced a number of lashes across the back.
Extramarital sex on the other hand is extremely serious and at the same time very hard to get convicted for. In the Holy Quran, it states that four witnesses to the act have to be found for it to be punishable. Here, unless a person has confessed or made a tape it’s unlikely to be considered as extramarital sex. Even if an unrelated couple checks into a hotel together, they will only be convicted of khilwa. In cases where a confession is made, then other things come into play, such as was it consensual or rape and whether either of them was married at the time. Infidelity is an automatic death sentence. Singles are imprisoned and whipped.
Young Saudis have their ways to get around these laws. One that I heard of is that they go in groups. Another is that the guy takes his sister along and voila it is no longer a khilwa.
Question, How is it a khilwa in a cafe where at least 5 other people are around?
Answer, you’re not supposed to go out in the first place.
Question, How about just a business meeting or any other meeting?
Answer, you’re not supposed to go out in the first place.
Question, Why am I getting whipped and lashed when I didn’t even touch her hand to shake?
Answer, you’re not supposed to go out in the first place.
See a pattern? You’re not supposed to see one in the first place ..
It’s hard to understand the motive behind the article. If the idea being proposed here is that people involved in khulwa and adultery should not be punished, that idea is not acceptable. If the point is that the punishment is too harsh, although I am a woman, I don’t think it is too harsh. The punihsment given here is the way Islam has asked to do so. Just because someone is sitting with unrelated person in a public place, doesn’t mean that it is not khilwa. But maybe there should be some exceptions for business purposes only when foreign business women have to work with a local Saudi partner. They have no choice but to communicate with the opposite sex. But other than that, it is not permissible.
The only purpose behind this post is to state how things are.
It does state how things are. But I hope it doesn’t support the concept of khilwa.
been 2 yrs…i jas f0und ds website..
theres no pr0blem in punishment in ksa..the pr0blem with them is they are n0t fair…m0st mutawwas unfairly take pe0ple wh0 cnt talk arabic t0 defend themselves..d0nt give lawyers…they are bias..trust me,it happened t0 pe0ple ar0und me tahts why i kn0w..i pray t0 Allah y0u w0nt be a victim 0f their misleading beards and sh0rt-th0bs..Allah Knows Best.
Ayesha
It is sad that inspite of being a woman, you are accepting such a blatantly discriminatory set of accepted social norms.! Remember the case of
a sentence of 40 lashes was handed out to a 75-year-old woman in Saudi Arabia! The woman, who was also sentenced to four months’ imprisonment, was found guilty of being in the company of two men, who were not her relatives. The flogging and imprisonment sentences against the Arab woman and two Saudi men were upheld by the country’s appeal court. The woman, identified as Syrian national Khamisa Mohammad Sawadi, along with two Saudi Arabian men — known only as Fahd and Hadyan — were found guilty in March 2009 of being in the company of members of the opposite sex who are not close relatives (known as khilwa). Fahd and Hadyan stated in their defence that they were delivering bread to Khamisa. Fahd argued that the offence of khilwa did not apply since he was related to Khamisa, who was his own uncle’s wife and had known him from the time when he was a child. The court, however, rejected this argument. One of the reasons for the rejection was that her youngest son is 10 years older than Fahd! Khamisa and Fahd were sentenced to 40 lashes and four months’ imprisonment each, and Hadyan to 60 lashes and six months’ imprisonment. The woman was also
sentenced to be deported to her native Syria on completion of her prison term inspite of being married to a Saudi national for many years!!
Do you have a driver? why is that permissible? Good journalism is to create discussion and thinking and she just did. Although I think that she is not a journalist. The Author just wrote few things for information purposes and made me extreamly laugh at it. Now if what she told us is not true, tell us. Otherwise I am sure islam did not forbid men and women to talk and since when “few slaps and punches” were OK in Islam. Maybe Saudi good men should rent a Taxi and drive around the good woman that he loves for the sake of God and drive around since that is OK.
Its women like the one above, Ayesha, who are keeping other women suppressed. You have to work together to be free
ok i understand you believe in upholding islamic law.
the punishment you state is not harsh.
if the woman was slapped around and whipped then perhaps you would think its a harsh law.
sadly violence and torture and unfair teatment seems acceptable to muslims.
the woman is guilty too.she should feel embarrassment and pain.
Thanks for the summary, and for the ideas about how young Saudis get around khilwa. I am in fact glad there is something akin to chaperoned “dating”, and group dating, so that people can get to know each other better (leaving aside the sex issue for the moment).
Sorry, premature submission.
Both group dating ie brothers and sisters dating in groups of friends, and chaperoned dating are common elsewhere, even in the West (double dating is often used as a form of having a chaperone/protector/friend nearby), and is a good idea. At least these options are better than marrying someone you have not had the chance to get to know.
Great Post,
I can see how such topics can be difficult to discuss, I don’t agree on authorities penalizing Khilwa, it will never stop, and it can’t be dealt with as such, capital punishments deserve to be visited by scholars for re-evaluation of a more evidence-based, constructive and less harmful punishments, keep on blogging!!!
salam o alikum
Akum sister
As far as from what I have learn, Umar AlKhattab as added the specific condition for one’s theft to be punish according to the hudud. As you mentioned above, there are certain amount. Second, if the theft steal because of poverty then the condition to fulfill the punishment is not complete thus the punishment cannot be done.
It is not easy nor it was something pleasant to be done. They are strict condition to be said.
Regarding the khalwah, it is a sin yet as long as they are not proved to commit sex etc they can’t be punish. As mere khalwah, in Islamic law we didn’t have specific rules only if certain country want to implement certain punishment it just called ta’zir.
Saudi woman,
I must compliment you on your very informative blog. I can see that it is very helpful in dispelling misconceptions in the minds non-Saudis, because you give an objective picture of how things are and do not support an unjust practise simply because it happens to be Saudi You are certainly not biased in your views.
Personally, I myself hold the view that even in case of a large-scale theft hands should not be cut off and there should not be any punishment for two unrelated people of opposite sex meeting in public. I feel Islamic rules should be interpreted differently with changing times. But I do appreciate your fair representation of cases.
Jai Babu,
Thanks for giving the details of that infamous case. I read another aspect of it somewhere – that the father of one of the youths – who said she was his uncle’s wife – himself complained to the religious police that these two men had gone to visit her. This was because she was a widow and as her relative, he was supposed to take care of her and thought by getting her deported he would be absolved of this responsibility. However, his plan backfired as his son was also convicted and sentenced to flogging.
It shows how these rules are being manipulated by some people to their own advantage. It’s not just a question of whether they are allowed Islamically or not. It seems some people want them in place so that they can be used to their gain.
Daisy,
Its a good thing people like you are not in charge of the affairs of the people. This is only for the creator of the heavens and the earth. Two statements for you: 1) May Allaah guide you (and if he doesn’t) 2) May he break your back (for increasing in misguidance for the people).
In reality, should you not be guided, its sufficient to know that you and anyone (myself included) who opposes Allaah and his messenger will be dealt with severely in the hereafter (whether you believe it or not). Turn to Allaah and seek his guidance. Why, So that you may be forgiven. Allaah has stated in his book that once he has decreed on a matter, you have no decision (even though you ‘think’ you do). If you have so much decision making ability, then prevent yourself from death. If you have any ability to come to terms that you are nothing but a created soul, then humble yourself before your soul gets snatched from your body.
So what gives you the right to claim to know the mind of God? That is arrogance in the extreme. Such arrogance can only result in backwardness; and for you it obviously has.
Saudi woman,
I liked your comment – the religious police go around looking for couples who seem to be too happy to be related!
La elaaha ellALLAH !
Be aware, I am quiet curious or simply doubtful about saudiwoman.
Real Muslim woman would never agree with what these religious matters are being twisted in the above article.
ALLAH (Almighty) knows the best.
But, I personally assume her as ignorant or the one spreading false meanings about Divine preordainment.
barbarian rules!!!poor womens, no possible for me life in SK
I don’t think i can remember the last time I read or heard a funnier phrase than “pairs who seem too happy to be related” I told this to my brother since he is the one who ever lived in the kingdom and the whole family are still laughing about this. You just made our month. Thanks for the insight by the way. Great, great article.
I’m glad you enjoyed it
hahaha ..
Saudis have to hopelessly fall in love to take such a risk .. ! :S
hahaha
thanks Ms. Eman ..
u know Ms. Eman .. I think khilwa thingi is a bullshit ( excuse my french)
coffee shops .. resturants.. are puplic places .. could be bussiness meeting .. friendship ..
maybe it could be applicable if they saw couples ( lovers) checking in in a hotel room or something ..
but a coffee shop or resturant .. man that is sick!
Quite frankly, the act of cutting off a person’s hand, for anyone for any reason is just pain wrong. You can’t justify such an act of utter brutality by saying, oh, we only do this for really, really bad theft! That’s a bit like saying, we only kill someone a little bit. Unfortunately, you fail to recognise that it is the act itself and it’s extreme brutality that is what is so shocking, not the reasons why it is done. If a child is chopped to pieces or even raped as punishment because it was viewed that it fit their actions, would you still agree to it? Of course not, because no matter what they did, it does not excuse acting with such barbarity toward them.
What about the victim? When you are brutal to others, you should be met with the same force. If someone has been given three chances to correct their brutality, cutting off their hand is justified. Unless we are the victims, we tend to sympathise with criminals. Children should not be punished for their actions.
Is the victim better off because the thief has been rendered a cripple and his chances of rehabilitation has been reduced?
You say that jacqueline I believe you’re french so why is there so much theft here in our country if you find the solution ? Did you hear about that girl who dead just because the thief wanted to take her mobile phone in the metro ? This law is just to protect our goods an Allah is fair !
Okay, so you have stated the situation regarding these punishments. What is your take on it? By refusing to comment on you are silently approving of these inhuman punishments.
well i read your article but i didn’t understand the end part? what do u mean take his sister along?
isn’t that’s called incest?
Living as a UK expatriate in UAE, I’ve found it very interesting to understand these other viewpoints and your blog certainly informs. Whilst I would find it difficult to agree with many aspects of the legal customs and conventions of your culture in Saudi Arabia, I certainly respect your right to have them. After all, there’s quite a lot about the Islamic way of life which is more positive and this should be recognised. Thank you for taking the time to tell us about it from your point of view.
I am sixteen and I am from Ukraine. This article realy shocked me. It is terrible things in your country. I am sorry for your people. It is not right to use these punishments. Relations between people are private and government shouldn’t spy for it.
“It is long past time for homophobia, misogyny, and moral judgment based on immoral books to be things of the past, and most of all long past time that we left behind the divisive and judgmental effects of mythologies from thousands of years ago. Let other people be ruled by unthinking dogma from outdated books, let reason and evidence speak for us. Step outside the box. Think, Criticize, Examine, and lets change the world”. -J Burgoyne
What I find astonishing is the way women in a country like KSA have no legal status as adults, yet are held fully accountable for “criminal” actions. How does that work? If you’re a woman and irrespective of age, on one hand, you can’t make any decisons for yourself regarding health, work, education, travel, marriage, freedom of movement (the essence really of being human). On the other if you are accused of any “crime”, the full wrath of the law (or how it is interpreted by judges) will fall on you and you will be made to pay the same (or worse) price than men.
How can such a system exist? Be justified? I certainly don’t think the answer is to ‘excuse’ women, thereby re-enforcing their child-like (lack of status) but such blatent hypocrisy is so disturbing.
Please NO questioning of the Qur’an….SUBMIT-OBEY-DON’T ASK QUESTIONS>
“O ye who believe! Ask not questions about things which if made plain to you, may cause you trouble. Some people before you did ask such questions, and on that account lost their faith.” (Surah 5:101-102).
005.101
YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! Ask not questions about things which, if made plain to you, may cause you trouble. But if ye ask about things when the Qur’an is being revealed, they will be made plain to you, Allah will forgive those: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Forbearing.
PICKTHAL: O ye who believe! Ask not of things which, if they were made unto you, would trouble you; but if ye ask of them when the Qur’an is being revealed, they will be made known unto you. Allah pardoneth this, for Allah is Forgiving, Clement.
SHAKIR: O you who believe! do not put questions about things which if declared to you may trouble you, and if you question about them when the Quran is being revealed, they shall be declared to you; Allah pardons this, and Allah is Forgiving, Forbearing.
“The Holy Prophet himself forbade people to ask questions …so do not try to probe into such things.” (The Meaning of the Qur’an, Maududi, vol. III, pgs. 76-77)
“The prophet was asked about things which he did not like, and when the questioner insisted, the Prophet got angry. (vol. 1, no. 92) The Prophet got angry and his cheeks or his face became red. (vol. 1, no. 91) “Allah has hated you…[for] asking too many questions.” (vol. 2, no. 555; and vol. 3, no. 591, Bukhari’s Hadith commenting on Muhammad’s reaction to hostile questioners.)
Wow, so if you ask questions you might find that the answers prove that your faith is flawed and you should abandon it? So dont ask questions – just live with a faith that is likely flawed (since you cant ask questions about it, presumably under the threat of physical attack). What kind of reasoning is that? Its no better than a 5 year old’s thinking. That whole post is the reasoning of a child: a violent intolerant child without wisdom. Anybody (who thinks and asks questions) can see that.
If there can be no questioning of a “holy book” – why/how did yours come into being, if not by questioning both of the two well known “holy books” already in existence (in the region)!!?? And several more, worldwide!
THEY were all questioned, by a few, who then created their own, of similar intent, to subjugate the masses — otherwise you would not have the one you use now, nor would Christianity have the one IT uses now!
Ironic that your book is the revelations of a white European that created a book as harsh as the Old Testament that preceded it by 2500 years, and pontificates a message little different – (the wrathful/vengeance & jealous God), but whose followers changed with time, necessity & survival, and saw the lessons & interpretations were perhaps viewed by lesser intellects of the day, and were worthy of some reinterpretation and reconsideration. Perhaps a little humility as well, as religious leaders of today are nothing more than people, and too often little more than hypocrites.
you are perferctly correct…
As a follow-up comment; if women in Muslim countries have half the legal status of men, if the word of a woman is worth half of that of a man’s in a court of law, then why be held legally fully accountable for ‘wrongdoing’? Under sharia, do women suddenly, magically acquire a full brain and mind when they are seen to step out of line (or just be accused of that)?
To most Muslims, the Quran is like a software license. Nobody actually reads it. They just scroll to the bottom and click “I agree.”
Also remember that reason and logic are completely lost on most people infected with the mind virus of Islam.
Allahu Akbar
I would not call any religion a ‘virus’ per se. The act of indoctrinating others and not allowing any room for the possibility and capacity to develop one’s own mind is though. Islam has been no different than the other two monotheistic religions in this respect.
“The Holy Prophet himself forbade people to ask questions …so do not try to probe into such things.” (The Meaning of the Qur’an, Maududi, vol. III, pgs. 76-77)
“The prophet was asked about things which he did not like, and when the questioner insisted, the Prophet got angry. (vol. 1, no. 92) The Prophet got angry and his cheeks or his face became red. (vol. 1, no. 91) “Allah has hated you…[for] asking too many questions.” (vol. 2, no. 555; and vol. 3, no. 591, Bukhari’s Hadith commenting on Muhammad’s reaction to hostile questioners.)
Essentially then there is no answer to my question? Would I be merely dismissed as a ‘hostile questioner’?
I’m interested as to whether this issue has EVER been seriously put to and addressed by the powers-that-be (Mullahs etc.) and any attempt made to justify (no matter how illogically) why women can be legally held fully accountable and punished under the law for their actions in a country that denies them adult legal status and where they are therefore deemed NOT responsible for their lives.
All three of the Middle Eastern invented desert ideologies based on Abraham are in fact mind viruses. Once the programming has been indoctrinated on blank slates (youth), then enforced by family & the surrounding environment, then it’s almost impossible to remove it’s longterm effects.
Of course criticism of Islam is not racism…as ISLAM IS NOT A RACE.
It’s time to bring Islam up to the modern standards of Judaism & Christianity….by asking questions!
Without criticism, Islam will remain unassailed in it’s dogmatic, fanatical medieval fortress, ossified in it’s totalitarian, intolerant, paranoid past. It will continue to stifle thought, human rights, individuality, originality and truth.
Sound about right?
Yes, but as I understand it, Islam is seen as a religion that cannot be questioned or ‘updated’ as the Koran is the direct word of God, as told to the Prophet.
It’s been interesting to read about the recent and ongoing debate concerning khilwa or khalwa – the forbidden, private mixing of unrelated men and women and the Saudi term – ikhtilat – meaning the ‘innocent’, public mixing of the sexes for the purposes of business, work etc, AND that Islam has been misinterpreted in KSA with regard to this.
I read this online:
‘Sheikh Ahmad Qassim Al-Ghamdi, chief of the Makkah region’s Hai’a, told the Arabic-language daily newspaper Okaz that ikhtilat has no basis in Shariah, or Islamic law, and has been incorrectly applied in the Saudi judicial system’.
I don’t know how much of a long term impact this will have in KSA but it’s quite amazing that it’s being opened up for debate at this level. Maybe change – updating, re-interpretation – whatever you want to call it, IS possible.
The PUNISHMENT of theft by removing the hands of the guilty is JUST….it’s just not enforced as it should be here in Arabia, as ALL of the members of the SAUD tribal family, & their cronies, would be amputees!
these punishments are meted out on the people in the name of religion and Islam preaches it is a religion of peace, where is the peace if it cannot tolerate its own people.I think that the Quran that dictates all these barbaric punishments should be rewritten to make it more tolerable and humane . Punishments like stoning , cutting of parts of your body , beheading , blinding etc., cannot come from God or his word, there fore it is clear that such harsh treatment meted out on women and offenders come certainly from the devil. Saudi and other Islamic nations need to rethink.
“I think that the Quran that dictates all these barbaric punishments should be rewritten”…
So you want our Glorious Quran to be re written so that this Glorious Quran can be turned into corrupted scriptures written by people of so called 21st century… just as how the Christians have done with their bible and the Jews with their scriptures…these ignorant people sold God’s words for money…they weren’t worshiping God in first place they were worshiping money(also currently the 21st century god of humankind).
Quran is for eternity not just for 7th century, Quran has no prescribed time, its for every century till the the Last Day. Yes the punishments are cruel but they are lessons for humankind… that don’t go astray(commit immense sins) or else you’ll suffer.
Who defines justice? I don’t neither do you!Humans don’t define justice, it is God who defines Justice and if God prescribed certain severe punishment for evil doings then it must be so and the criminal should be punished. Even in Saudi arabia, some rules are not followed according to the Quran and the Sunnah, judges have their way of punishing whoever they will without proper reason and witnesses, even the person without the charge can get punished…this is unjust in Islam and therefore proper justice must be done according to the two sources(Quran and sunnah).
what a complete of of bull written by ‘nk’ on the sacred un-adulterated quality of the Quran.
The Quran was already written as a modification of the Christian gospels that in turn where a political take on the original Jewish Torah that predates all of them and has not been changed (ever).
By what authority does the Quran have any reason to be considered more than a compilation of stories written 1,400 years ago by a group of semi-literate desert tribesmen who had a world view constrained by their time and totally unaware of all the science and knowledge we live with today (evolution and bacteria for example).
There is too much insecurity among people who do not allow their belief’s to be questioned and challenged. What are they scared of?
THIS SO BAD TO KNOW OF SHARIA LAWS PEOPLE STEAL DUE THEY HAVE PROBLEMS ONLY NOT FOR SIMPLE THINK WAT WILL HAPPEN TO THERE PARNETS THESE TO BAD OF SAUDI LAWS . THERE MUST BE A WAY TO SLOVE THING THEY SHOULD GIVE THE THEFT 4 OR 6 MONTHS JAIL AND RELEASE HIM NOT TO CUT OFF HIS HAND THINK IF HE HAS GIVE A CHANCE TO LIVE HE MIGHT LIVE AND WORK SUPPOSE IF HIS HANDS ARE CUT WAT WILL HE DO IN THIS WORLD . SO PLEASE CHANGE THE LAWS PEOPLE LOVE EACH OTHER AND GET MARRIED THEN ONLY THERE LIVES WILL BE GOOD WE ARE NOT SUPPOSE TO INTERFARE IN THERE WORLD I CAN UNDERSTAND WAT OUR PROPHET (PUBH) SAID US BUT RETHINK IT YOUR ALSO A HUMAN SOME DAY U WILL ASLO DO THEY THINKING IN YOUR LIFE
.
Only a brutal society that could tolerate amputation for theft or indeed decapitation. This is a poor reflection on the KSA. Sharia Law is inferior to Common Law developed in England and what is better is that we have a complete separation of Church / Mosque & State.
Society that tolerates brutal punishment becomes brutal and violence becomes acceptable. In addition to brutal punishment, ‘law’ in KSA is dispensed in a haphazard way by religious ‘scholars’ and many innocent people are brutally punished. ‘Sharia Law’ = Bronze Age Lack of Civilisation
I love the civilization of the West and really enjoy all our ‘evils’ of civility, equality and religious freedom.
We should be critical of any society which visits amputation on its criminals. But what of a country which does further than that and deprives them of life? A country which separates religion from its civil activities? The country? The opinion leading US of A no less.
The USA doesn’t execute people for extra-marital sex though, or similarly ridiculous reasons, as Saudi Arabia does. You can’t really compare the harshness of the American legal system with the shear mediaeval barbarity of the Saudi one. However, the USA is guilty of supporting the Saudi regime, which receives the most American aid of any nation other than Israel, and that is something Americans should be ashamed of.
ok this is how things are ! but what is your take on this are you saying that this is inhuman and barbaric or you also agree with this kilawya and hand chopping things ?
Please remember when commenting the reason we suspended similar punishments in developed western countries wasn’t because we felt the death sentence was too harsh (or “barbaric” as one poster put it) for any crime. Many still advocate the death penalty and if we still lived by the bible’s code it would still be implementing it as a punishment.
The reason we primarily stopped it was because we were putting to death people who were innocent of the crimes of which they had been found guilty, we simply could not ensure convictions where fair. The problem with the penalty is that, unlike imprisonment, if a punishment is overturned (usually by the addition of evidence or the trial was found to be unfair) you could not restore justice. The ultimate penalty demands the perfect system to stand up to any level or moral scrutiny.
Also it became difficult with immigrants to implement it as a punishment since it was quite possible they were ignorant of the crimes they had committed until after committing the offence. We didn’t want judges to apply different standards to people living in the same country.
The only argument that holds here is to ask “What is justice for?”. Is it more important to seek retribution on those who break laws (eye for an eye) or to rehabilitate those who commit crimes into normal members of society again?
Take this hypothetical scenario (especially Westerners amongst you), someone kills a person close to you in cold bloody. However you find out the killer had a mental disorder from which he could be cured just by giving him one pill. Obviously he will be convicted but should he be sent to jail or set free now he isn’t a threat to society?
abdul,
you hit it right on the mony. By the way, I applaud you women for what you are doing to extend yourselves and gain freedoms for women within these societies that are oppressed. I was in KSA in 1990 during the war,( from America). At that time, I was invited to a corporal punishment downtown for some women who decided that they were allowed to drive ambulances because they saw the American women driving, has that changed? I really doubt much has changed in KSA, it’s just one of those countries.
Hala,
you sound like a very intelligent woman very capable of many things, what are you still doing in that country?
i heard it once..der is s0me seas0n that NEW mutawwas roam ar0und t0 catch s0me pe0ple they knw is n0t related and they knw als0 isnt d0ing anythng wr0ng except that they accidentally met in st0re and chat f0r awhile…if they catched plenty..they g0t 500sr or s0me am0utn each pers0n…and this gives them g0od remarks t0 the organization…and yes..they are m0re strict t0 n0n-arabic-speaking pe0ple in kingd0m..s0metimes its very unfair…m0re saudi girls g0 out with saudi boys but they cnt determine c0z they are c0vered…. Allah Knows Best..
@nunu – How does one take serious the reply from any individual who repeatedly uses zeros as vowels, omits vowels in others and combined zeros and “o” in the same word? What kind of childlike communication attempt, as much an effort to appear generationally “hip” – can be taken seriously, when the very idiocy they represent runs rampant in their ability (or inability/refusal) to conform to simple rules and standards of communication? Allah may know best for you, but I implore you to pray for some skills and self respect when it concerns communicating with others, especially internationally.
What happens to the Saudi prince, while they do the wrong thing according to KSA law?
Is kingship is a Islamic system or own system made for fun?
Ich bewundere die mutigen Frauen, die für die Gleichberechtigung in ihrem Land kämpfen!
http://fr0schwabi.blogspot.com
Saudi’s are the real thevies, they loot the haj and umra pilgrims, expats. Ask any expat who lives in saudi arabia, they always suggest not to take a cab with a saudi local. even their women fear entering a cab driven by saudi’s. The police is completely biased. Sometimes, there are alot of stories, where in some poor developing countries workers are setup for the crimes they have not committed. Having lived in saudi arabia, earlier, I know what the reality is. Saudi people are complete hypocrates. I think, these people donot respect other people, they think they are above all. America should invade this country to make them understand and feel the sufferings of fellow human beings, how it would feel for them to live and work in a foreign country. They take the passports of expats and harrass them as bonded labours. Management by harassment. Imagine, all the countries retaliate the same way when they visit other countries. It is very difficult to get a fair trail for any person. Especially for expats…..
10 Facts of Saudi Arabia
1. Never take a cab with saudi local driver.
2. never trust anything that is written in the contract, please get it translated before you sign.
3.As soon as you enter Saudi Arabia, they will take your passport and hold it and control your movement back to your home country.
4. Female Maid servants life is miserable, please do not take up jobs as female maid servants, as they are subjected to sexual harassment and 90% cases are that you are forced to have sex with the head of the family and the children of the family. These are real true stories faced by people who have worked. If any body approaches the authority, the police will suppress the cases.
5. Recruitment job profiles completely differ on paper and in reality, people are recruited by stating that they will be working in an office and their passports are taken away and forced to work as labourers or shepherd in the fields.
6. Please do not trust any saudi agent who takes in alot of money for getting a visa, they make money by selling you.
7. They force people to work from 7 in the morning to 10 in the night sometimes till 12 in the midnight.without overtime payment.
8. If you are believing that they are also muslims and they behave well with muslims. that is not true, they are wahabis and they believe that who ever comes in here is slave to work for them.
9. All the media is state controlled, nothing goes out independently and alot of red tape is present.
10. COME TO SAUDI ARABIA, IF YOU PREFER TO GIVE UP ON YOUR LIFE AND NEVER TRUST A SAUDI.
All these things can and do happen. But that doesn’t make all Saudi people bad. I know many very good, honest, trustworthy Saudi’s. What is needed is a better system and due process so that the bad people can’t take advantage of the weak and disadvantaged. Because the system allows all kinds of bad things to happen. But that doesn’t make all Saudi’s bad- it only means the bad ones can do what they like.
behind close doors Saudi Royal Family and Elite do not follow any thing that they preach, DRUGS, Prostitution and CORRUPTION are the way of life in saudi arabia.
God is completely overtaken. Forming a state and law and government based upon religion is rediculous
Pingback: Public punishment in modern world shame by Facebook | Russell Webster
oh this is very hard rules
its gud. but. 1 thing is wrong.. maybe i no understand, if 1 man doing sex with female both agree then saudia govt gave punishment? if yes… like cutting head its very very very wrong boz both are agree male and female then why punishment?? its wrong i acept 1 thing if any man do rape with girl then he able to get punishment so i request plz don`t do this….. saudia is good country i respect but remove this thing if 2 male female agree then dont gace punishment if no punishment then its okjay 
i dont know about this rules maybe all thing is ok :p by by…
Articles and comments are very interesting and informative here. But reading your blog is such a cultural shock for a guy like me who lives in Montréal. Keep on the good work, saudiwoman! –Sylvain Beauchamp
In England the Police do not carry Side Arms. In Ancient Times the Price for Killing a Swan, was Death. Crime is not Tolerated in Totalitarian Societies like Medieval Spain, The Former Soviet Union, or Communist China ect ect. Crime is the Price a ” Free Society ” pays for its Freedom. That does`nt make it Wrong or Right, It is merely a Statement of Fact. The Capitalist World is a Cruel Bloodthirsty Game; But It does has It`s Rules. No Real Ethic or Morality; Only Rules. Rules and Regulations ?
Wow! Way to go on this blog. I am NOT surprised to see Saudi women fighting back. But I have to say, it sounds like you all live in a giant public prison! It is surreal–you cannot decide to whom you speak or with whom you have coffee? You cannot drive a car or select a profession?! What are your leaders trying to hurt their own communities? A community cannot flourish if leaders surpress half of its population. Why are so many of the men threatened by women? Do they see women’s entry into public society as a threat to their own power? This is silly thinking! You are all on the same team, as a whole community. Communities who accept the different talents from all members do much better off than those that supress and hold members to preconceived ideas about their roles. It is like a person thinking with only half a brain! Women have an important contribution to make to the public sector. Just as Men have an important contribution to make to the home. Oil will not last forever! Saudis need to learn to develop talents and compete on an internaltional scale–this will require WOMEN!
There is need for such articles to know about Saudi Arabic.
There is need for such articles to know about Saudi Arabic